trust-me-im-lying

Is it lying to quote-mine a book that may not even be true? Or is that justified in the theocratic war that WT feels it is in?

Many of you have read that the Watchtower Society and its writers have taken quotes out of context, or even completely misquoted an expert or a book altogether to justify their policies or doctrines. This article illustrates a similar example that goes back over 40 years…and still has not been “fixed” by Watchtower. In fact they continue to quote from a work of historical fiction filled with salacious accounts of sex, gore, torture, and bestiality as recently as March of 2013. So let’s get to the reference of this book and when it was first quoted by Watchtower:

In 1972 the Aid book on page 828 quoted an author by the name of Daniel Mannix, in the article on “Incense”. They quote Mr. Mannix as stating that early Christians refused to give service or worship to the emperor. What the writers of the Aid book likely did not know at the time though was that this book is a work of historical fiction and contains many extrapolations and embellishments, that was authored by a professional sword-swallower and illusionist. In addition, the book is filled with many salacious stories and accounts that would land any rank-and-file Jehovah’s Witness in hot water if they wrote or even read such a book![1]

Aid book Mannix quote

In 1972 the Watchtower Society quoted from a salacious book of historical fiction

This author’s book and accompanying quote from it has been referenced or reproduced by Watchtower at least 14 times. This was confirmed by doing a search on JW.org and also on the Watchtower Library CD-Rom. It has been used in the School brochure, Reasoning Book, Insight on the Scriptures, at least six times in the Watchtower magazine and three times in the Awake Magazine. Here is the most recent citation where Mr. Mannix’s book is quoted from:
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Like Jesus, early Christians courageously rendered worship only to Jehovah. (Matt. 4:8-10) They refused to burn incense in honor of the Roman emperor. (See picture.) “Very few of the Christians recanted,” wrote Daniel P. Mannix, “although an altar with a fire burning on it was generally kept in the arena for their convenience. All a prisoner had to do was scatter a pinch of incense on the flame and he was given a Certificate of Sacrifice and turned free. It was also carefully explained to him that he was not worshiping the emperor; merely acknowledging the divine character of the emperor as head of the Roman state. Still, almost no Christians availed themselves of the chance to escape.”—Those About to Die.

Modern Christians held in Nazi concentration camps with possible death facing them were given repeated opportunities to gain their freedom by signing a declaration renouncing Jehovah. But few signed. Risking death during a genocide in Rwanda in recent times, Tutsi and Hutu Witnesses protected one another. Such trials call for courage and faith.

The Watchtower of 9/15/2002 page 22 uses the reference to buttress their view that saluting the flag or standing for the national anthem would be inappropriate for Christians. A fair question to ask though is Mr. Mannix’s book appropriate for Jehovah’s Witnesses to read? Here is a review from one reader of the book on Amazon.com:
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Probably the most provocative work of historical fiction published this century,”Those Who Are About To Die” is pure Mannix at his best. A uncensured exploration of what likely took place in the circuses of ancient Rome. Filled with all the bloodshed, sadism, torture, sex and beastiality that Mannix could reasonably document. Just as fascinating today as when it became a cult classic thirty years ago. Mannix is the only author brave enough to make a career out of documenting man at his most inhuman. Hard to believe he also wrote the story for Disney’s “The Fox and the Hound”! If you liked “Caligula” you’ll love “Those Who Are About To Die”! But don’t forget to follow-up with his “The History of Torture”, and “The Hell Fire Club” if you can find a copy.

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Another Amazon review under the re-released name of the book, “The Way of The Gladiator” is here:
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This book is a reprint of “Those About to Die,” which was published back in the late 50’s, when Mannix was in his heyday as a writer. I came to know Daniel P. Mannix through his many articles for the 50’s publication “True: The Man’s Magazine.” He was a competent writer on many subjects, and his stories were always entertaining. “The Way of the Gladiator” is nothing if it is not entertaining. But it is NOT a piece of sober history.

The book is not so much historical fiction as it is fictionalized history. Historical fiction is a make believe story told against the backdrop of historical events. Mannix takes historical events and relates them in “documentary” fashion, but unabashedly invents details and descriptions which, if they are accurate, are accurate only by accident.

If you understand from the outset what you are dealing with, “The Way of the Gladiator” can be great reading. If you’re looking for a well researched, scholarly study of gladiators, check out Michael Grant’s “Gladiators.”

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Yet another review of the book that spells out that it is historical fiction is here. In all fairness there are some that contest this, and maintain that the book actually is historical non-fiction.[4] Also, the substance of his quote seems historically accurate and Mr. Mannix appears to have been a nice person and certainly was an accomplished and talented man. A biography of his life mentions this (in part) about him:
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…His varied career included time spent as a sword swallower and fire eater in a traveling carnival sideshow, where he performed under the stage name The Great Zadma. His magazine articles about these experiences, co-written with his wife Jule Junker Mannix, proved very popular and were reprinted several times in 1944 and 1945, and later expanded into book form in his 1951 account of carnival life Step Right Up, which in turn was reprinted in 1964 as Memoirs of a Sword Swallower…Mannix was also a skilled stage magician, magic historian, and collector of illusions and apparatus.

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The biography makes no mention of him being a student of Roman history or a scholar per se. But what does all this back story on Mr. Mannix teach us about The Watchtower? Simply this: Watchtower writers under the direct supervision of the Governing Body will quote from anything that supports their position. Credibility seems to be a secondary consideration.[5] Whether it is journalistically sound, or the author’s reputation is in question makes little difference in at least this case. Another example is their extensive quoting in times past of Johannes Greber.[2] This went on for many years, until it was finally pointed out that the man was an occultist. Only then did they stop using him as yet another “expert” to support their doctrinal spin on theology. After some 30 years of mining Mr. Greber’s quote they ceased to do so, and dropped a subtle reversal into a 1983 Questions from Readers article on the last page of that issue.[3]

As for how many more years the Watchtower will continue to quote from yet another dubious source to further it’s goals remains to be seen. It is entirely possible that a future Watchtower “Questions From Readers” article will redress yet another journalistic prevarication found in the pages of what most Jehovah’s Witnesses consider to be inspired writings of Jehovah.
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mannix quote - WOL

A search for the author’s book on the JW.org online library performed the day of writing this article.


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NOTES
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[1] Recently a videotaped visit from two elders was put on my YouTube channel, JWStruggle. In this video, two elders come to give counsel to a sister that had written a book that contained some romantic scenes as well as some swear words. They make it theior business to inform the sister and her husband that some have been stumbled over her book due its “graphic language and content”. It is my opinion that the frequent and long-term quoting by Watchtower of Mr. Mannix’s book is an offense that is 10,000 times as egregiousness as this sister’s novel.
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[2] Quote from the Watchtower 1962 9/15 p. 554 par. 5 “The Word”—Who Is He? According to John:


Similar is the reading by a former Roman Catholic priest: “In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was a god. This was with God in the beginning. Everything came into being through the Word, and without it nothing created sprang into existence.” (John 1:1-3)*

*The New Testament—A New Translation and Explanation Based on the Oldest Manuscripts, by Johannes Greber (a translation from German into English), edition of 1937, the front cover of this bound translation being stamped with a golden cross.

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[3] *** w83 4/1 p. 31 Questions From Readers ***


■ Why, in recent years, has The Watchtower not made use of the translation by the former Catholic priest, Johannes Greber?
This translation was used occasionally in support of renderings of Matthew 27:52, 53 and John 1:1, as given in the New World Translation and other authoritative Bible versions. But as indicated in a foreword to the 1980 edition of The New Testament by Johannes Greber, this translator relied on “God’s Spirit World” to clarify for him how he should translate difficult passages. It is stated: “His wife, a medium of God’s Spiritworld was often instrumental in conveying the correct answers from God’s Messengers to Pastor Greber.” The Watchtower has deemed it improper to make use of a translation that has such a close rapport with spiritism. (Deuteronomy 18:10-12) The scholarship that forms the basis for the rendering of the above-cited texts in the New World Translation is sound and for this reason does not depend at all on Greber’s translation for authority. Nothing is lost, therefore, by ceasing to use his New Testament.

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[4] For more debate on this subject click here. I would like to personally thank the poster named Lied2NoMore, as his original post on this topic was very helpful in the compostion of this article.
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[5] Interestingly, the Watchtower in one of the 14 times they quote from Mr. Mannix decides to describe him as a “historian”:

*** Teacher book, chap. 27 p. 146 Who Is Your God? ***

Early disciples of Jesus would not do an act of worship to the Roman emperor, which the historian Daniel P. Mannix said could be compared with “refusing to salute the flag or repeat the oath of allegiance.” (Emphasis added)

Rating 4.42 out of 5
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20 Comments on JW.org continues to quote from a dubious book filled with bloodshed and sex

  1. Frank says:

    Hi Eric. Can you clarify whether you are saying that early Christians did burn incense to the emperor or that the WTBTS are using flag salute as a modern example is inappropriate?

    The issue you raise here is important, so it’s best to get a crystal clear understanding of what you mean.

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    • JJ says:

      Hi Frank! I didn’t comment on any of that as my main point was that WT was/is using a dubious source that exemplifies their underhanded journalism.

      The point in the Aid/Insight books may be spot on correct but regardless, their sources are flawed.

      I personally no longer feel that this equates on a 1:1 basis with why Christians could or could not salute the flag of their country. It is a conscience matter for each to decide.

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  2. danielB says:

    The “authoritative” nature of the quotes that “the Society” uses , is no better than the imaginations of those authors that they quote from . Why would anyone accept such quotes as being at Jehovah’s direction , without a bit of research ?

    I love that expression that the WTS has used so many times : . . . ” thinking persons ” . Of course they use that expression to mean that thinking persons will see things their way , right or wrong . However , as it was with the Bereans of Thessalonica , the noble Christian will make careful examinations .

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  3. Reader says:

    Dear All;
    What we read is an association with the author(s), they speak we listen, input, mind food, company too.
    Proverbs 13 v 20 applies I think.
    B

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  4. JimmyG says:

    Here are 2 more examples that you can add to the list:

    1. The WT isn’t too concerned about the credentials of the people they quote. In the early chapters of the Creation book, there are 13 quotes from a book called ‘The neck of the giraffe’ by Francis Hitching. You would think that the WT liberally quotes him because he is an expert, a scholar, a scientist or similar.

    He is in fact none of the above. He has no scientific credentials at all. He is though, known as a sensationalist TV script writer, paranormalist and believes that dowsing is genuine, among other things. He is said to be an ‘evolutionist’ in the Creation book. What they don’t say is that he is NOT a Darwinian evolutionist- there’s quite a difference.

    He claimed to be a member of the Royal Archaeological Institute, which he wasn’t. He claimed to have notable people as supporters of this particular book including none other than Richard Dawkins, which they weren’t. When asked about this claim, Dawkins is quoted as saying, “I know nothing at all about Francis Hitching.If you are uncovering the fact that he is a charlatan, good for you. His book, The neck of the giraffe, is one of the silliest and most ignorant I have read in years.”

    He has authored a number of other books. You can get an idea of what sort of person he is from the titles of these books- ‘Pendulum: the psi connection.’ ‘Dowsing: the psi connection.’ ‘Earth magic.’ ‘The mysterious world: an atlas of the unexplained’.

    2.This is an example of misrepresentation of scholar’s work by the WT. The WT issue of Nov 1st, 2011 contained an article. ‘When was ancient Jerusalem Destroyed? Part 2’ In the ‘notes’ section at the end of the article, note 5 refers to a quote used in the article (footnote 18a), authored by Dr John M Steele. A person emailed Dr Steele, alerting him to the fact that his work had been quoted in this article by the WT. This is his reply:

    “Thank you for your email concerning the citation of my work in the recent Watchtower article. As you suggest the author of this piece is completely misrepresenting what I wrote…(then he highlights some technical points)….Just glancing through the Watchtower article I can see that they have also misrepresented the views of other scholars by selective quotation out of context.”

    I read recently that the WT has a ‘Keystone Kops’ type of approach to science writing. Back in 1969 author Alan Rogerson said, “A long acquaintance with the literature of the Witnesses leads one to the conclusion that they live in the intellectual ‘twilight zone’.” What would he make of all the tripe that has been written by the WT since then, no better illustrated than by the convoluted fairy tales in the 4 study articles in July 15th, 2013 issue of the WT!

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    • JJ says:

      Outstanding examples Jimmy. And there are so many more!

      In Carl Jonsson’s excellent book, “The Sign of the Last Days- When?” he talks about Watchtower quoting from a scientist that studies earthquakes. The man seems to be saying that “earthquakes have escalated in the last 100 years” but it turns out he is saying the exact opposite. Jonsson wrote the scientist and asked him if that’s what he told Watchtower. He received a response and included the man’s letter in the book, where the scientist says that Wt quoted him completely out of context. Yet another false quote from Watchtower

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  5. DS211 says:

    How about the nature of and violence in the Bible story book utilized to “teach” toddlers and children? Not to mention a childs early introduction to sexual conversations? Fits in there too I’d imagine. And why arent those brothers and sisters who were “stumbled” on the chopping block as well? I had an experience recently where a local needs talk was given about dress and grooming. The elder on the platform went into very explicit detail, describing that outfits today are made to almost reveal the areola of a womans nipple and that sisters shouldnt wear too high of a heel and referred to them as hooker heels. Sound like spiritual food from Jehovah? Likely not.

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  6. Newly Enlightened says:

    Awesome job Eric! Just another example of WTBT$ cherry-picking their quotes. I guess they’re running out of real historians to quote.

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  7. C M says:

    The problem with the Watchtower is this, they are not being spiritually guided as the only group chosen by God, nor are any of the people who research, investigate, write/publish scholars or experts of any kind when it comes to the scriptures. That is why they have made this mistake many times, quoting only small portions of writings that agree or go along with what they teach, and not even researching who this person is and what they believe in. Some even go as far as only researching nothing but older WT publications to support the thought they are trying to get across. It is just insane, we are all humans and are somewhat entitled to make a mistake, but none of us claim to be God’s one and only channel, and that is where all of our disilusionment comes from, we thought we were in the “TRUTH” and that everything they said came from “God” who had in some way guided the FDS to publish for us to read, now that we are awake and using REASON and are thinking for OURSELVES we can see how inaccurate alot of the information published by the WT really is.

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  8. Frank says:

    Thanks for your clarification, Eric. I am intrigued by your viewpoint because I agree with it and would like to expand it.

    However, I was listening to a debate yesterday in which one of the debaters mentioned that early Christians refused to burn incense to the emperors. This was the ‘second witness’ that makes it fact (as far as I am concerned) of the truthfulness that Christians would not carry out what they believed were acts of worship to the state, and certainly not to the emperors.

    Tell me, Eric, what in your opinion is the difference between burning incense to an emperor and saluting the flag?

    Frank

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  9. pastasauceror says:

    When I read the title I thought to myself, of course they do, they’re a “Bible based” religion.

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  10. Frank says:

    Hi JimmyG, welcome back. This is the point I wanted to make about whether we should trust the ongoing ‘bad research’ done on literary works that make such grandiose claims about themselves. The Creation book just makes me cringe now when I read it, much like being treated in the Revelation Climax book how the Governing Body (now self-styled ‘Faithful and Discreet Slave’) fit so nicely into the Revelation prophecies!

    Enter professional intellectuals and this is what you get:

    “If you ask what actually motivates my atheism, for example, to come on to a Christian show like this, I think it was my encounter with the Jehovah’s Witnesses because they produced a book called Life – How did it get here, by Creation or Evolution, which contains a huge pack of falsehoods. I mean, I’m sure that the people distributing that book, I suspect many of them are very sincere; they sincerely believe what’s written in that book. But if you look at the things in that book and trace it back and look at what the original scientists actually said, you can see the book misquotes them terribly. So, the knowledge that religion, or some religious people, were actively distorting what scientists believe, it led me to see a lot of religious people as being victims of that propaganda, and that’s one thing that really kind of motivates me.”

    – Atheist scientist Robert Stovold – “The Big Questions in Science and Religion,” Unbelievable, July, 2008

    Of course, as Stovold says, it’s not JWs who are insincere. The Creation book even contained the references to its research. In hindsight it was probably not wise to do so. Bad research could be forgiven the first and second time. After that there is the smell of agenda.

    Frank

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    • JimmyG says:

      Hi Frank. I didn’t go anywhere- it’s just been so quiet lately on this site. I cringe too at the Creation book. It just can’t be taken seriously. I have just ‘scratched the surface’ of misquotes and use of deception in this book, in highlighting the non credentials of Francis Hitching. Here’s another one:

      Creation book, p39: “At this point a reader may begin to understand Dawkins’ comment in the preface of his book: ‘This book should be read almost as though it were science fiction.'”

      Source of the quote- ‘The Selfish Gene’ by Richard Dawkins, 1976.
      What the author conveniently leaves out is what was written immediately after this statement, which is as follows: “It is designed to appeal to the imagination. But it is NOT science fiction: it is science. Cliche or not, “stranger than fiction” expresses exactly how I feel about the truth.”

      I could go on…………..

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  11. Frank says:

    Hi Eric. Of course, the point is valid; Mannix is only a ‘historian’ in the same sense as Dan Brown is. Both have written fiction with a researched background. When the WTBTS dishonestly calls Mannix a ‘historian’ they surely must realise that someday someone will point out the weakness of many ‘arguments’ brought as ‘proof.’This is the gift of the Internet.

    Dan Brown fascinated people with his ‘history’ but it essentially could not be taken seriously. The difference is that Brown never claimed to write ‘history,’ only a novel.

    JimmyG. Dawkins has been quoted out of context in the Creation book. The WTBTS suffices with “Australopithicus is overwhelmingly simian” but fails to take context into consideration. Creationists do the same with Darwin’s comment about the collapse of the Evolution theory if Darwin couldn’t explain the eye. Straight after his saying this in Origins, Darwin explains exactly he he thought the eye evolved!

    Frank

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  12. Reader says:

    Dear All;
    Poor argumentation does not mean the cause is lost or wrong, only badly represented.
    A change in presentation or presenter is required.
    I felt drawn towards evolution in later childhood however my own Awe of nature quashed it. Probably most people are firmly of one viewpoint or the other, and changes are mainly of those in agnostic viewpoints.
    The top down system creates the ‘our glorious leader’ form of behavior, whereas a little contestant discussion -can improve the unsteady. Proverbs 27 v 17

    B

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  13. Frank V says:

    Hi Reader. I’ve read your comment over and over again, but I can’t make out what it is you’re exactly saying.

    If you think anyone here is making a bad argument, please tell us why and give your ideas. Democracy, not theocracy, reigns here.

    Frank

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  14. Jen says:

    Thank you for the research on this topic. I too researched Mannix and his books and agree that this is unacceptable. I am learning so much now that I too have had the courage to delve deeper into the truth about the “truth”. Freedom is a beautiful thing!

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  15. Max Powers says:

    http://www.HolyBibleVerse.com is a Holy Bible search engine & study tool with 100 online versions of the Bible. It’s free, nothing to install & no sign-up.

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  16. ironmaiden1976 says:

    I don’t have a lot of time to sit here and post on this website too much, but if you look at mr.jd Parsons which the watchtower uses in the Insight book and reasoning on the scriptures Book to prove that Christ did not die on a cross. check this guy out and also check out his book entitled our Sun God or Christianity. I have the book on Google Books in which this man speaks completely against the Bible. But at the same time he says that he is Christian. I have an idea that he’s an apostate against Christ. It is one thing to denounce a particular organization, it is another to denounce the Bible and Christ himself. He has a complete chapter on the name Jehovah and he goes as far as to say Jehovah is the Sun God himself

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  17. RickyG1978 says:

    When I read the quotes about Mannix’s book back in 2002 and saw the title, it immediately reminded of the movie Gladiator. Well, sure enough, Those About to Die and another one of his sick, twisted, sadistic books was the basis of the movie Gladiator. Sad to say I am guilt of viewing that movie. Just reading the reivews of that book on amazon.com was sickening! I did extensive research on WT and Mannix. He is quoted in WT publications 12 times from 1972-2013, and that’s all the available book on the WT Library CD. There are a lot of publications no longer available on the CD, only in personal or kingdom hall libraries. What struck me, reading all those quotes, none mentions him as a historian UNTIL 2003 when he is finally mentioned as a historian in a book designed for children to read, Learn From the Great Teacher. Hmmm… Wikipedia also says he wrote a biography on an occultist – but take that with a grain of salt as it was not verified as I want to stay away from spiritism!

    I also researched Johannes Greber. In 1983, WT lied and said that they didn’t know about this guy until 1980 when he came out with a new edition in his bible, where he says he relied on his spirit-medium wife to translate for him. But in 1955 and 1956, they condemned for being a Catholic priest who dabbles in spritism. Shortly after those condemning quotes from two of Grebers spiritistic books, one of which isn’t even a bible translation, they begin to use his translation to refute critis and support the way the WT translated Matt 27:51, 52 and John 1:1, as if to say “Hey, we aren’t the only ones who translated these verses this way, LOOK! Greber did it the same way also.” We are even invited to compare WT’s bible with Greber’s satanic bible! Lies, lies lies. You can not partake of the cup of Jehovah and the cup of the demons. Now I clearly see why Jehovah required the Isrealites to completely destroy everything in the Promised land, because it was steeped in spiritism. Achan and his family were put to death for keeping money and clothes from one of their victories of the Promised Land. How much more worse for him to have kept an “ouiji board” or “a spiritistic view of the 10 commandments” to support what Jehovah himself had given Moses. Garbage! There seems to me like there is a LOT of copying and pasting going on with the WT, with no research whatsoever. The GB made it their point recently to show how extensive their research is, stating that before they could print a quote about a spider’s web being able to stop an airplane midflight, they had to know if it was true or not. They researched it, got with the scientist that said that, researched it and THEN they were confident that the statement was true, so therefore they could print it in an article. Seems to me they need to stop worrying about spider’s webs and start investigating if their spiritual food has close rapports with spiritism, as mentioned in the 1983 WT about Greber.

    In the WT’s book, What Does the Bible really Teach, on p.158 there is a picture of a lollipop that fell on the ground, dirty, with old leaves near it. It is used to prove a point that it really does matter where celebrations and holidays come from. I was absolutely sick after I was done researching Mannix and Greber! Quoting from spiritistic books and putting a “historian’s” sadistic tale of gore in a book my 7 year old and 4 year old look at is just beyond words. And for what? To prove a point? If the point is already correct, why even bother looking to garbage to support truth. Truth is truth and it stands up to criticism on it’s own.

    If my wife was on board with me, or even if I knew she would not leave me and take my kids away from me, I would turn in my DA letter immediately, hand my keys over to the kingdom hall, run away and never look back!

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