tearsWe have written a number of times on the site about disfellowshipping and shunning of a fellow brother or sister. We know that even Jesus himself was “disfellowshipped” by the Jewish Sanhedrin. As currently practiced, this Witness doctrine goes far “beyond the things that are written” (1 Corinthians 4:6) by enforcing a list of over a hundred different things a person could be expelled for [1]. How much needless pain and suffering has this doctrine caused you or someone you love? 60,000 are added to this list by elders that are “just following orders” every year. Thousands of brothers have stepped down and resigned their position over the last several decades due to this and other aspects of the harshness and judging that they are pressed into service to do to their “fellow slaves”. (Matthew 18:28)

The following poem [2] has been and continues to be inspirational to many that have been affected by this un-Christian practice:


IT HURTS to discover you were deceived – that what you thought was the “one true religion,” the “path to total freedom,” or “truth” was in reality a cult.

IT HURTS when you learn that people you trusted implicitly – whom you were taught not to question – were “pulling the wool over your eyes” albeit unwittingly.

IT HURTS when you learn that those you were taught were your “enemies” were telling the truth after all — but you had been told they were liars, deceivers, repressive, satanic etc and not to listen to them.

IT HURTS when you know your faith in God hasn’t changed – only your trust in an organization – yet you are accused of apostasy, being a trouble maker, a “Judas”. It hurts even more when it is your family and friends making these accusations.

IT HURTS to realize their love and acceptance was conditional on you remaining a member of good standing. This cuts so deeply you try and suppress it. All you want to do is forget – but how can you forget your family and friends?

IT HURTS to see the looks of hatred coming from the faces of those you love – to hear the deafening silence when you try and talk to them. It cuts deeply when you try and give your child a hug and they stand like a statue, pretending you aren’t there. It stabs like a knife when you know your spouse looks upon you as demonized and teaches your children to hate you.

IT HURTS to know you must start all over again. You feel you have wasted so much time. You feel betrayed, disillusioned, suspicious of everyone including family, friends and other former members.

IT HURTS when you find yourself feeling guilty or ashamed of what you were – even about leaving them. You feel depressed, confused, lonely. You find it difficult to make decisions. You don’t know what to do with yourself because you have so much time on your hands now – yet you still feel guilty for spending time on recreation.

IT HURTS when you feel as though you have lost touch with reality. You feel as though you are “floating” and wonder if you really are better off and long for the security you had in the organization and yet you know you cannot go back.

IT HURTS when you feel you are all alone – that no one seems to understand what you are feeling. It hurts when you realize your self confidence and self worth are almost non-existent.

IT HURTS when you have to front up to friends and family to hear their “I told you so” whether that statement is verbal or not. It makes you feel even more stupid than you already do – your confidence and self worth plummet even further.

IT HURTS when you realize you gave up everything for the cult – your education, career, finances, time and energy – and now have to seek employment or restart your education. How do you explain all those missing years?

IT HURTS because you know that even though you were deceived, you are responsible for being taken in. All that wasted time…at least that is what it seems to you – wasted time.

Leaving a cult is like experiencing the death of a close relative or a broken relationship. The feeling is often described as like having been betrayed by someone with whom you were in love. You feel you were simply used. There is a grieving process to pass through. Whereas most people understand that a person must grieve after a death etc, they find it difficult to understand the same applies in this situation. There is no instant cure for the grief, confusion and pain. Like all grieving periods, time is the healer. Some feel guilty, or wrong about this grief. They shouldn’t — It is normal. It is NOT wrong to feel confused, uncertain, disillusioned, guilty, angry, untrusting – these are all part of the process. In time the negative feelings will be replaced with clear thinking, joy, peace, and trust.

There is life after the cult.

[1] This poem was written by a Christian sister named Jan Groenveld. Jan passed away in October of 2002. You can see an online memorial to her at: http://www.freeminds.org/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=478:in-memory-of-jan-groenveld&catid=3:rank-file&Itemid=333


[2] The publications have brought out that a person could be put out of the congregation for things such as:

• Gluttony
• Oral and anal sex, if practiced by a married couple
• Contract work at a military establishment
• Buying a lottery ticket
• Alerting other members that someone in the congregation is a convicted pedophile (deemed “slander”)
• Selling tobacco
• Obscene speech
• Artificial insemination or being a surrogate mother
• Boxing

This list is by no means complete. The above items all share the distinction of not having a single Bible scripture specifically saying that they are “works of the flesh”. (Galatians 5:19-21) Some of these cannot even be conclusively proved that they are against God’s will! Is this what Paul had in mind when he wrote 1 Corinthians 5:9-13 under inspiration?

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53 Comments on Disfellowshipping Hurts

  1. Londo says:

    Thank you! I can’t think of any better way to sum that up!


  2. serein says:

    well i feel most of the above are a bad thing, wether it up to anyone to disfelowship someone for it depends on the situation, but then i dont beleive that disfelowshiping some one is right, i dont think family and freinds should be told to ignore the person whos done wrong, i think being a christian means loving not ignoring,disfelowshiping in my mind must be a personal thing between the family not the whole congregations if some ones done wrong then they should be just stoped from going to the meetings and all not disfelowed by all,if some one chooses to do boxing stated above and likes it and carrys on then they chose to hurt some one for a living to gain titles and money, thats not christian but dosnt mean there family should ignor em or freinds ,just an opinion from one of the above,disacotiation should be up to the inderviduals who choose not to talk to whome ever they feel they wouldnt rather be around if they feel uncomfortable.i mean i dont like being around people who swear or who are nastyi duno bad people with no love,so i keep my distance
    and thats it, same should go for people in the org,should be personal chose wether to speak to em if they leave, or if they got kicked out, if they got kicked out its there fault not family and freinds so its up to fam nd freinds if they wana still be around em, were i feel they still would be mostly if they dint have the flipin banishing and ignore rule.anyways what im trying to say is the rule isnt christian and no one has the right to say you cant talk to your flesh and blood or close freinds you may have had for many years, thats should be a personla matter,i dissed myself and get ignored all the time and hate it,and im still a christian and still love god and im a good person so being ignored isnt the nisest of things in life but it makes me sad for them not me as they have to comform to a rule made by man and taken to far,and they are so blinded they are so scared that paradise is iminent and they doing it for the good and cos god said to,i ignore most of my brothers fleshly ones cos they horrible peole not cos some one told me to but cos its a personal choice,i do think thoe that even thoe people are hurting for being ignored i think the ignorer is feeling just as much pain for having to do it also,if they dont feel itthen they arnt a true christian and have no love in them so then you shouldnt care cos who wants to be around people with no love in them for you,


  3. confused says:

    I feel exactly what she wrote, worst part is my only friend is my computer with limited use. I only only read and write hear and there, the computer does not replace a cup of coffee with a friend or a nice chat on the phone, being alone feels like hell sometimes.


  4. serein says:

    go out join a club a group make new freinds, saying that i dont go out much , but then im a bit of a loner and i like it that way.im your freind 😉 and ur note alone with your computer cos everyone is with you on theres and all with a cup of coffee


  5. Ruth says:

    A real good down to earth article JJ. So many I am sure will relate to that word HURT.

    Quote IT HURTS to realize their love and acceptance was conditional.

    That organization is teaching hate instead of true love. Mercy should triumph.
    True love never fails. Along with true unspoilt love comes true blessing.


  6. confused says:

    Anyone ever watch the movie It’s A Wonderful Life?
    If so, remember the scene where Jimmy Stewart is at the bridge and is thinking about jumping in and he is praying?
    I’m so there…….praying for help from HIM….
    No answer yet……
    I sound like a big cry baby I know.


  7. Eric Ramos says:

    Thank You JJ for posting that. Many can relate to those feelings. It will go a long way in helping others work through their stages of grief as it has helped me as well. Those powerful feelings can be overwelming and confusing. But this poem helped me to identify what I was feeling and why I was experiencing such powerful emotions, which in turn helped me to move forward. Thank You!


  8. Eric Ramos says:

    Confused, you are not alone. Many feel the way you do. Also, I do not think you sound like a big crying baby. If you are hurting it only proves you are human and have a heart. No shame in that.


  9. andrew says:

    I’ve been there also, confused. I’ve been on my knees crying out to God. He hears. He may not answer how we would like him to answer at the time, but does what is best for us over the long term.


  10. Bro. Ed says:

    Sister Confused, as others have already said, you are definitely not alone! There are multitudes around you who share in the same day to day struggle as you. You have met a small handful here and in time you will meet many others. An awakening is happening of those God has called out to. Ready yourself for what lays ahead. Keep strong in your faith in Christ. Listen to the Spirit in you even though you may feel at times it is leading you to unfamiliar places. “The wind blows where it wishes, and you hear its sound, but you do not know where it comes from or where it goes. So it is with everyone who is born of the Spirit.” (John 3:8 ESV)

    The Spirit in me says those that are fellowshipping here are doing so because the Spirit wants them to build each other up and strengthen each other; that means YOU and me and all those who share in the Spirit of truth. I’m sure that if we were present with you in the flesh we’d embrace you and comfort you with Christian love.


  11. John S. says:



  12. Ruth says:

    Bro Ed.
    Wow! that was so encouraging and so true.
    I also am on my own way down South in Australia.
    But! I know love dwells around me and will continue in Christ to grow even stronger. Our life has just began. Yes its so true.

    I must say thanks to the W/tower that I was able to learn confidence in myself. learn to speak publicly also. So lets take the good.
    Well! I would like a refund from all the Kingdom halls I have helped build and contributed to.

    Looking on the positive side of things, lets continue to love out father with all our hearts souls and minds. Love our neighbours as we would love ourselves.



  13. Bro. Ed says:

    Sister Ruth, I’m from Australia too…Melbourne to be specific.


  14. Camelot says:

    I am certain that this site is helping so many stuggling Witnesses. I DA myself this year back in May. I found this site right after I mailed my letter. I felt strong and hopeful that I would not allow leaving to effect my life negatively. I was blind sided. The impact of leaving the organization has been monumental. The stages of grief and ability to cope differ for each individual. In my case, it has been overwhelming because I don’t feel I can connect with God. I have even attempted to take my life. I feel lost, however, I am know without a doubt after all the research I did on the organization, most of which was through thier own literature, that they are not God’s prophet. I appreciate the concern and the exposure of the WTBTS false teachings that you do on this site. Thank you for the post JJ…. I wish more help was available.


  15. Bro. Ed says:

    Brother Camelot, our brother Paul, wrote these words for us, but not just for us, but to all who are shaken and feeling lost:

    “Likewise the Spirit helps us in our weakness. For we do not know what to pray for as we ought, but the Spirit himself intercedes for us with groanings too deep for words. And he who searches hearts knows what is the mind of the Spirit, because the Spirit intercedes for the saints according to the will of God. And we know that for those who love God all things work together for good, for those who are called according to his purpose. For those whom he foreknew he also predestined to be conformed to the image of his Son, in order that he might be the firstborn among many brothers. And those whom he predestined he also called, and those whom he called he also justified, and those whom he justified he also glorified. (Romans 8:26-30 ESV)

    Your brother in Christ


    • Camelot says:

      Thank you Bro. Ed I have to believe that I am worthy in his eyes and that my heart was inclined to be his servant as a JW and that he sees my heart wishes to do the same now even though I am not certain of how I can do so. I am 44 and a mother and grandmother who wants very much so to teach my daughter (still a JW who shuns me) that there is a place to go when you leave. I will continue to keep fighting :)


  16. Bro. Ed says:

    Sister, apologies for referring to you as “brother”. Reason this way then: If you have departed the organization because the Spirit in you has called you to God, then continue letting the Spirit direct your life even when you may think it is too hard to endure. Remember, difficult times go hand in hand with being a Christian. But it is because we have chosen to know God, or as Paul rightly says, “rather to be known by God” (Galatians 4:9 ESV) that we can all share our burdens in Christ.

    The Apostle Paul wrote:
    “Who shall separate us from the love of Christ? Shall tribulation, or distress, or persecution, or famine, or nakedness, or danger, or sword? As it is written,
    “For your sake we are being killed all the day long;
    we are regarded as sheep to be slaughtered.”
    No, in all these things we are more than conquerors through him who loved us. For I am sure that neither death nor life, nor angels nor rulers, nor things present nor things to come, nor powers, nor height nor depth, nor anything else in all creation, will be able to separate us from the love of God in Christ Jesus our Lord. (Romans 8:35-39 ESV)

    Continue on sister. Be always patient with those who don’t yet understand where the Spirit is leading you.

    Your brother in Christ


  17. disappointed says:

    Dear sisters (and brothers). I can understand how painful it must be to be cut off from family and friends. It hasn’t happened to me yet but I feel fearful that one day it could. I’ve found great pleasure in finding friends outside the WTO, we’ve been warned that these are ‘bad’ people to be avoided. But through my pc I have made some wonderful friends with beautiful personalities. Some I’ve been able to go on and meet in real life. They have enriched my life. Try joining forums where you can meet people with similar interests as you. Keep a low profile to begin with, find out more about them in an ‘open environment’, begin to talk about your mutual interests and friendships will slowly blossom. We are human, we need friends. Even here we share something special with each other, an understanding of how each other are feeling right now. Agape love to all of you… your sister.


    • jacqueline says:

      I agree disappointed. I found new friends. The Bible Students today parents, aunts etc were either DF’D or left and ostracized. They have helped me because they are all in the same boat. They are broadcasting the entire 3 day convention on adobeconnect this weekend. For those that would like to see in person the “evil slave”, so dibbed by the society.
      The link is on the http://www.friendsofjehovahswittnesses.com site. Also they will broadcast every Sunday now for you to see the speakers and the audience. Also you can type to one another. They disregard the witness DF’D as all of their relatives were at some point in time. So was Jesus. Good article.


  18. Wakeupwitness says:

    The Society truly goes beyond what is written when it comes to disfellowshipping. A simple line of reasoning is……if it ain’t in bible, there’s nothing wrong with it.
    Case in point: birthdays. What is so harmful in a birthday party for a person or child?

    I never understood that witnesses could celebrate wedding anniversaries even though they aren’t mentioned in the bible.
    Double standard? You betcha!


  19. serein says:

    its been a year since i dissed myself and i was out of it for at least a year befor that
    not going to meetings and all just the odd one here
    and there.it took that long to feel free from the burden of guilt i felt ,you know that i may have betrayed god and omg what have i done and such, but now its easyer i look back and feel sad for being taken in but happy that i got so much from it also i realy did, il never follow a group that claims they are the only ones who are aproved by god again and that if i dont stay with em im doomed that hurt me so much thats what hurt me the most feeling doomed,i dont feel like that now iv searched so much that im now at an understanding better than i was befor and feel happy with life now,they put fear in you that goes so deep you feel so low for leaving,but dont it gets better the more you learn and the more you accept that god loves you for searching out truth and staying with him not with a sect that rules you with fear of god in stead of love of god,


  20. DanielB says:

    It does hurt to be disfellowshipped .

    I also think that the disfellowshipping begins while we are still in the organization . We start out being shunned to some extent by the elders and then no doubt by our own family members . If we are meant to undergo the death as Jesus underwent , then we start gaining that insight early which helps us to know what’s coming . Perhaps it’s better to “disassociate” though .

    There is the JW mindset that has been instilled in us , which says that ‘we know that we are in an approved condition before God , while Satan’s world outside is only walking in sin’ . Then one day we begin realizing the false humility in this thinking . And it turns out that when we were carrying “the utensils of God” , that we only had some of them and other Christians have some also . And so we will go on with a warning not to do this way to our lives again . It’s very painful .

    But go on brothers and sisters . Remember that the society has encouraged those ‘on the outside’ to become “thinking persons” in the Watchtower and Awake!

    On the ‘outside’ then , we can think better , without the veil of JW-speak . And for your conscience sake , please do not pretend to be supportive of such things as tolerance for their evils and cruelty .

    It amazes me how that the local congregation elders would not even open the Bible in considering brothers for elder and ministerial servant responsibilities , and the rash methods tolerated when sitting down on judicial matters . I knew that it wasn’t according to the prescribed process that the GB had directed . At least they would print some considerate proceedure . And I know that if I could turn back the clock and had insisted earlier, and more fervently , that we follow the letter of the Word , that I would have been ousted even sooner . And then , the GB puts the stamp of approval on the local elder body decision to impale the sheep , and put into office the kind of men with horns to shepherd the flock .

    Oh well . Live and learn .

    Such are the politics of men . So I knew that it was not the organization that it was supposed to be .

    My heart goes out to you , brothers and sisters . Be strong , in Christ .


  21. Bro. Ed says:

    Disfellowshipping, as it is now technically referred to by the society, was never a judicial process in the first century. For the very limited references made in scripture to what one could loosely call “disfellowshipping”, the act of removing someone professing to be a brother (or sister) from amongst believers is limited to the following unrepentant conditions:
    “But now I am writing to you not to associate with anyone who bears the name of brother if he is guilty of sexual immorality or greed, or is an idolater, reviler, drunkard, or swindler—not even to eat with such a one.” (1 Corinthians 5:11 ESV)

    Now each of these may have broad implications, but in truth they are quintessential tenants of what is already laid out in scripture as things detestable to God. The key to this is simple, JUST DON’T ASSOCIATE with these ones. But here is the wonderful grace that God offers those that repent from these sins:

    “Now if anyone has caused pain, he has caused it not to me, but in some measure—not to put it too severely—to all of you. For such a one, this punishment by the majority is enough, so you should rather turn to forgive and comfort him, or he may be overwhelmed by excessive sorrow. So I beg you to reaffirm your love for him. For this is why I wrote, that I might test you and know whether you are obedient in everything. Anyone whom you forgive, I also forgive. Indeed, what I have forgiven, if I have forgiven anything, has been for your sake in the presence of Christ, so that we would not be outwitted by Satan; for we are not ignorant of his designs.” (2 Corinthians 2:5-11 ESV)

    Note that there are no time frames, no special conditions, no seeking approval from a higher authority, just plain simple forgiveness and a reaffirmation of LOVE!! This is Gods way.

    Your brother in Christ.


  22. DanielB says:



  23. John S. says:

    Don’t look b’ck;Luke9;62…Now th’t you r free-work-to-grow in-strength-truth;grow-strong-in-truth—Let-the-ded-bury-the-ded—-follow-Jesus’-words—the-fine-shepherd—be-wise-don’t-follow-kults-or-those-slyly-promoting-kults—These-r-tiedup-in-old-19th-century-doctrines,You-bros-leeding here,keep shining forth our Lord’s techings,it’s whot we need now,not teechings of some person who is considered the FDS by modern-Bible Students.Some ex-Witnesses r going from the frying p’n into the fire,not knowing the huge pile of untruths behind this worship-kult.These need to dig deeper before recommending ‘nother-cult-to-hurting-Witnesses-There-r-good-reserchers-here,ded-set-on-sticking-to-the gospel….Their teechings st’nd out;very simple,powerfully logic’l…uncoplic’ted.Fellow Witness bros.n sisters seek the Holy Spirit on bended knees,He will teech ,comfort,guide,n dwell in-you—–dont-feer—John14;17,26…your-brother-in-the-fight-for-truth—–John-S


  24. Ruth says:

    John S.
    So true my brother. Agree with what you are saying.


  25. John S. says:

    Th’nks,Ruth,n’so-true-your-words;give-credit n be proud the-yeers-u-served-in-field-ser.,cong.get-togethers,etc.You were-being good followers-of-Jesus’instructions.We-know-wern’t-the-only-ones-who-feel-this-need-to-b-free.Others-r-listening-or-r-on-the-rode-in-this-direktion-seeking-to-be-free.To-be-free-to-think-n-do-whot-we-feel-is-right-is-God’s-gift-to-us—–our-best-gift;it’s-whot-defines-our-intelligense;we-will-kontinue-to-shout-fight-for-life-n-die-for—–to-be-free—to-serye-with-our-whole-hort-soul-brein-strength;we-will-ne’er-be-sorry-for-our-yeers-of-speeking-n-enkouriging-our-neighbors–NO-ITS-WOT-DEFINED-US;We-still-heer-the-ekho-in-our-eers-of-=those-who-did-respekt-wot-we-were-doing;were-proud-for-us-when-they-sed;’You-people-r-doing-fine-work’——Kin-I-get-e-‘So-be-it’–The-Fother-n-Son-r-estreenly-PROUD-OF-YOUR-FINE-WORK;n-we-r-not-not-done-preekhing—-not-yet—the-fields-r-white-with-people seeking-kingdon-truth—–n-righteousness-not-folsehood.Love-not-tyrenny——–Let’s-show-these-the-wey;the-internet-highwey-the-WT-is-efreid-of—-for-they-feer-they’ll-lose-their-power-not-desiring-to-see-their-poor-beet-up-floks-get-well-with-power-of-the-Holy-Spirit;n-hense-they-r-fighting-eginst-the-HOLY-SPIRIT-whot-is-et-work-in-our-herts-n-inds-n-is-cossing-us-to-speek;–Kin-I-get-e-SO-Be-It-here—–Bless-you-n-the-work-we’re-doing—–Lord–;n-FotherJoh—do-kontinue-2-bless-this-site-with-strength;kourige;n-power-thru-the-Spirit;Don’t-let-us-return-to-the-things-behind-like-pigs2filth-but-grow-stronger;wolk-on-till-we-no-longer-struggle-but-wolk-n-run–kleer-to-the-end—until-we-see-you-koning-on-the-klouds-to-bring-your-Kingdon;nd-our-reword——-thru-Jesus-we-prey-to-you-Fother


  26. Ruth says:

    Amen to that brother.


  27. Ruth says:

    Hi everyone.
    I would like to say l have been so encouraged by you all. Your experiences and what some of you have had to endure and still are is quite significant. Yet! you have opened the door and let Jesus come into your hearts to reach and teach you.
    It is so encouraging to see faithful ones coming to a place of peace and true love. A place of renewing minds.

    Myself have reached a point where l completely trust my father to do do his will only.
    Romans 8:28 is a very enduring scripture from the Lord himself to confirm in our hearts we are in deed his children. We do not have to worry anymore.

    Thanks so much for your generous encouragement.
    May Our Father bless you all in your search and growth along the highway of eternal life.
    Much love from your sister Ruth.


  28. Bro. Ed says:

    And you sister Ruth!


  29. Daniel Metz says:


    It is clear to me that you want Jehovah’s Witnesses to become Protestants, who claim to believe the Bible but disregard parts of it, such as disfellowshipping. Their concern is making as much money while they are alive and going to heaven after they die. They tolerate fornication and adultery in their churches because they don’t want anybody to feel “hurt”.

    Believing Jehovah’s Witnesses, on the other hand, since the days of Brother Russell, have approached the Bible differently. We believe that the Bible is not a source of arguments to justify what we want. We believe that it is truly Jehovah’s inspired Word, and that we need to apply carefully what it says in order to please him. That includes “not mixing in company with anyone called a brother who is a fornicator,…”. There is no exception made for family members or for friends, so nobody has “hurt feelings.” What matters is keeping the congregation clean.

    Don’t criticize the Governing Body for holding to this Biblical standard. Criticize Jehovah God, if you must.

    If you still are an “active Witness”, JJ, don’t you think that it is time that you cease that hypocrisy? If you are still active, as you claim, you attend our meetings, sing our songs, go out in service (what in the world do you say to the householders, I wonder?), while not believing what the vast majority in the Kingdom Hall believe, namely, that Jesus Christ is actively guiding his present-day congregation just as he guided it in the first century, using the apostles and older men of Jerusalem, as we have just reviewed in the Bear Thorough Witness book.

    Meanwhile you post these articles here, hiding your name, because, according to you, you are afraid that your elders will “kill you spiritually”.

    I have no respect for cowards and hypocrites, JJ. At least the disfellowshipped on this site, with whom I will not engage in a conversation, though I have written what I think about their twisting of the Scriptures and the publications, are honest people.


  30. Daniel Metz says:

    Why don’t you just leave and join the Bible Students or the Christadelphians, or a Protestant church, and stop pretending to be a believing Jehovah’s Witness?

    None of your attempts at making unscientific “surveys” of the unbelieving Witnesses who visit and approve of the articles on this site will influence the Governing Body to go against what the Scriptures say. Why not? Because they HAVE FAITH in Jehovah and in his Word. They are not hypocrites. They know that giving in to fear of man, and the desire to be popular with the majority, would only lead to Jehovah withdrawing his spirit.

    This is what I wanted to write you in response to your emails to me, which I must have deleted because I can’t find them now. I don’t desire any more communication with you. I have written what I believe Jehovah wants me to write to you. It may be too late for you to escape from Satan’s snare. Or maybe you will wake up to the folly of Raymond Franz’s philosophy, who gave in to Protestantism, and who was offended that he was outvoted in the Governing Body, and did not have the faith that Jehovah was working through the consciences of the majority of its members, and did not agree with his personal conscience, molded by Protestant commentators. Raymond Franz was angry that he was not informed that he was being investigated, but Brother Schroeder and the others realized that he had been playing the hypocrite for years behind their backs, just as you are, JJ, and I fully approve of how they handled that coward, who didn’t have the courage to say clearly that he didn’t believe in putting the Kingdom first by zealous preaching, no matter when Armageddon comes.

    That is all I have to say to you, JJ. I hope I never am moved to write anything else on this site.


    • JJ says:


      You are free to express you feelings here, and I think you have done that openly! For that I commend you. If we sat down ans talked I think that you would find that we agree on some many things than we disagree. And I know that you would acknowledge that we love our Heavenly Father Jehovah and his Son Jesus very much here on the site.

      You said that you feel God impelled you to write what he wants you to write on here. That is something that we tool also have in common. We have been motivated by our consciences and by God’s Holy Spirit to confess, deconstruct, and talk about these difficult issues. Last time you said you were done here and not coming back. Yet you felt you needed to return any way. Good for you Daniel. We have not anger or hatred but love for you. Indeed Jesus’ sermon on the mount tells us to love and to pray for those hating us. (Matthew 5:43-48)

      As a small “inside joke” to you my brother (I know you will get it), I sing this song to you as I type it, to hopefully make you smile:

      My shoes are Japanese
      These trousers are English
      The red hat on my head is Russian
      But even so, my heart is Indian

      In Christian Love,


    • greybeard says:

      Dear Daniel Metz,

      I have personally known JJ for many years and the last thing he is is a coward or hypocrite unlike yourself who holds the governing body up high and then fails to obey them. As Andrew told you, you know quite well the rules about the internet. You must be above the rules. You said Jehovah wanted you to write JJ? Here is something Jehovah has written YOU:

      ISAIAH 44:25, 26, “I am . . . the One making the word of his servant come true, and the One that carries out completely the counsel of his own messengers.”

      Has Jehovah made the words of the GB/JW/org come true? EVER? Does he carry out completely the counsel of his own messengers? What does the record/facts show that all the world is fully aware of including yourself and all JW’s? Any bells going off? It is you who are like the hypocrites in religion today that blindly follow men. You are lost and grasping at straws. You use a straw mans argument every time you speak. All you do is condemn. You want to point us back to man, men who’s words do not come true. Men who lie! Where does JJ point men to? The same place I do and all those on this web site does, Jesus Christ.

      You obviously do not know anything about Ray franz or his writings. Do yourself a huge favor and continue to disobey the governing body! Get Ray Franz books and read the truth about the religion you love so much. You say he was a known hypocrite? Really? Is that why he was on the governing body for so long? Everyone knew he was a hypocrite? What does that say about them? Stick around Daniel, don’t be a slave to man and you might just find the real truth!

      Firm but with love,
      Your brother in Christ,


      • greybeard says:

        Dear Daniel Metz,

        Wow, I just searched your name on http://www.jehovahs-witness.net/ and found some of your comments. You even posted this and more:

        “I have just thought of a way to leave Jehovah’s Witnesses using information from the new Shepherd the Flock of God book. It’s quite simply: rebaptism. Here are the steps:” More here: http://www.jehovahs-witness.ne.....Painlessly

        What can I say?

        Hmmmm… I now realize you have gone through much depression brother and I can understand that because I have too. Many of us have. Just know that we are NOT the bad guys, most of us here are anointed brothers in Christ. We love you and hope the best for you. There is nothing wrong with reading this site or searching online for answers. It is only wrong when you uphold the governing body as Gods chosen slave “over all of his belongings”. If you really do believe that, you are going against Christ himself. Of course we do not believe that. Has any of their words have ever came true? ISAIAH 44:25, 26 / I truly do hope you stick around and find peace in your heart.

        With warm affection for you,
        Your brother in Christ,


    • mjm says:

      who are u to judge those who leave org take u are still a jw if u are not perhaps u might know how it feels to be shut out maybe u shouldnt be looking at this website


  31. andrew says:

    Daniel Metz, you have no idea how much courage it takes for someone to listen to their conscience and go against what they have been taught.

    I know JJ and he has taken courageous action and put himself in the line of fire to do what is right and also to help others. The same can be said of many others here and most certainly of R. Franz. The easiest thing in the world to do would have been to simply ignore our conscience and retain our good reputation with our friends and family. R. Franz, JJ, and many others have decided that they have to obey God rather than man no matter the cost.

    Daniel, you say that you have no respect for cowards and hypocrites. You know very well that the Society has condemned reading and responding to the blogs of so-called “apostates”. Do you tell your elder body that you read and comment on an “apostate” blog? Do you pretend that you don’t read “apostate” material? Would this make you a coward and a hypocrite according to your own definition?

    When I was a follower of the Watchtower as you are it was also quite easy in my mind to deal out judgment and condemnation. May Jehovah and His son have mercy on you just as they had mercy on me.


  32. Disappointed says:

    Daniel, the bible tells us that someone should be shunned if they are practising fornication and calling himself a brother. But what if it’s something else?

    The real problem here is those who have done exactly what the Society tell other people to do.. examine their religion. We have done that with our religion and what we have found troubles us deeply. So what should we do? Leave it you say? Don’t be a hypocrite. OK.. so we leave, suddenly, abruptly.. then what? We are shunned.. by everyone we love, all our family, everyone we grew up with, friends we thought were our friends for life. We DO NOT believe we are leaving Jehovah, Christ Jesus or the Bible, what we do believe we are doing is following our Lord Jesus Christ and his teachings instead of 7 imperfect men in Brooklyn and their teachings. We would rather be followers of God and his Son than man. Unfortunately they see that as disloyalty to Jehovah and anyone who leaves suddenly will be shunned. All we are doing is finding the truths in God’s word and sharing them with each other. Here we find a place where we can talk with each other, find comfort with each other through an extremely hard process. Daniel, you know you shouldn’t come here if you are following the Society’s orders, so why are you here? Doesn’t that make you exactly what you are calling us? A coward and a hypocrite.


  33. Bro. Ed says:

    Daniel, each time you post a comment, you justify me. You are the antithesis of Christ like behavior. You assume so much and perceive so little. You dedicate your time to declaring us as unworthy of Gods grace, casting stones with each comment. Am I one that condones sharing in the sin of a brother or sister who unrepentantly continues to practice sexual immorality? No, and no one here has ever, ever spoken of fellowshipping with those that practice immorality. But if we know some brother or sister that has committed any sin against God or his fellow brother, and then help that one back to our Father through repentance, we would welcome them back to our fellowship in a heartbeat. We would love them and forgive them as God and our lord Jesus would, because that is what love is. No waiting and time limits to “make sure”, no waiting for judicial committees subjecting them to further harsh treatment. No sitting week on week at the back of the hall with just the occassional nod of approval from others. No! That’s not Gods way. Read first and second Corinthians to see how real Christians treat those that loose their way and sin and how the congregation deals with this. It’s nothing like the disfellowshipping rules of the Witnesses.

    Please keep coming back to post Daniel so that others can see the condition of the heart one has, being a faithful servant of the “Watch Tower Bible and Tract Society of Pennsylvania Inc”

    Bro. Ed


  34. Daniel Metz says:

    Greybeard has written me and has told me that JJ no longer goes to meetings since very recently. He told me that JJ has “faded”. He told me that the “About” for JJ on this site needs to be put up to date, since he is no longer an “active Witness”. That means that I no longer believe that he is a hypocrite, pretending to be a Witness when he isn’t one. I am glad that he has made a clear choice, as have the other contributors here.

    This is most likely my last post, unless I change my mind. I think I have said all I wanted to. Now it is time to concentrate on my service to Jehovah. I went out in the service this morning and gave the witness in Korean with my brothers and sisters. Today I will prepare the Watchtower article for tomorrow on Why Be Guided By God’s Spirit? and do my Bible reading and April magazine reading. I am so happy being one of Jehovah’s Witnesses, enjoying the fantastic spiritual food from the “faithful and discreet slave class”, which is guided by Jehovah’s holy spirit. Later today, I hope to meet some Egyptians that a sister found in our territory and witness to them using the Bible in Arabic and the Quran, which I will bring along.

    It is good that we have all found the religion that satisfies our hearts. You have found the Protestant-and-Ray-Franz version of Jesus Christ, and I have found Jehovah and his Son Jesus Christ, who I can see are clearly using the Governing Body of Jehovah’s Witnesses, who love the field service the same as I do.

    To each his own.


    • JJ says:

      I hope it is not your last post Daniel, but if it is I wish you well. We can all learn from each other- I from you, and perhaps you from us. There is no “JW version of Jesus” or “Ray Franz version of Jesus” either. There is just one perfect man, that gave his life for ours.

      Paul said:

      “For both the Jews ask for signs and the Greeks look for wisdom; but we preach Christ impaled, to the Jews a cause for stumbling but to the nations foolishness; however, to those who are the called, both Jews and Greeks, Christ the power of God and the wisdom of God. Because a foolish thing of God is wiser than men, and a weak thing of God is stronger than men. (1 Corinthians 1:22-25)

      Then in chapter two:

      “I did not come with an extravagance of speech or of wisdom declaring the sacred secret of God to you. For I decided not to know anything among you except Jesus Christ, and him impaled. (1 Corinthians 2:1, 2)

      So ours is a simple message- Christ impaled, sacrificed for us- a free gift is what we have been given. Not one that can be earned by filling out numbers on a time slip, or filling a seat in a Kingdom Hall, but only given through undeserved kindness, or the more elegant term for it, GRACE.

      God’s grace saves us. The Lord Jesus’ shed blood saves us. Amen!


  35. Bro. Ed says:



  36. DanielB says:

    Selah !


  37. Willie says:

    Dear Daniel Metz, The founders of this site are very diplomatic in dealing with Jehovah’s Witnesses, past and present, and I am sure that they have anticipated comments such as yours. On the other hand, I am merely an old woman whose time is short, so I am more likely to tell it like I see it. I do not intend to be critical, but since we do not see ourselves as others see us, I would like to give you some insight and advise you that your recitation of activites could be perceived as braggadocio. Perhaps it is because you feel comfortable and safe in what you believe. I too feel secure in my faith and understanding of the Bible and I want only the highest good–spiritual or earthly–for you and for all mankind.

    Matt. 6:3 says that it is preferable that our right hand doesn’t know what our left hand is doing. Granted, the reference is to alms-giving; however, ALL our efforts in the service of God IS alms-giving in my opinion. “But we are all as an unclean thing, and all our righteousnesses are as filthy rags…” according to Isa. 64:6; thus, we have two very good scriptural reasons why our works should NOT be a matter of “SHOW AND TELL”!

    Jam. 2:18 puts it succinctly, “Yea, a man may say, Thou hast faith, and I have works: shew me thy faith without thy works, and I will shew thee my faith by my works.” A faithful and loving heart WILL produce faithful and loving works–but not necessarily the works demanded by an organization. In Eph. 2:9 we are warned, “Not of works, lest any man should boast.” There is a thin line between confidence in our beliefs and spiritual pride–the latter is an insidious state of affairs. (Pro.16:18.) We cannot EARN our salvation; “For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves; it is the GIFT of God” (Eph. 2:8).



  38. Eve says:

    Very well said, Disappointed and Willie……thank you.


  39. use 2 b a dub says:

    for many years I was an elder but no more since 2010. Recently I had a fading brother ask me a very interesting question. He know that he has sinned seriously by committing adultery and needs to be forgiven. He is not df’ed and does not feel that he needs to go to the elders who will undoubtedly DF him.
    His family is still strong JW’s and his wife is sickly so he knows that if is DF’ed it will rip his family apart and devastate his wife of 35 years. He says he is truly sorry and that he was going through a very depressing time in his life when he was being unfaithful. I have know this brother for decades and he is a good man and a good father and husband. I don’t know how to answer him since I’m still kinda stuck in the WTS way of handling these matters.
    I told him that only Jehovah can forgive him but he still wants to know if he should tell his wife and family about his unfaithfulness.
    He seems very worried that it could cause his wife serious emotional damage from which she may not ever fully recover.
    Help me to help this fine man that has sinned.
    use 2 b a dub


  40. DanielB says:

    Use 2 b a dub , could it be possible that the brother you refer to would come here for council himself ? This way he would follow the Scriptural advise and direction . [James 5: 14-16] He would get the help and consolation , and know that he did the right thing .


  41. use 2 b a dub says:

    Good point. I will ask him to do so again as I have already proposed this option to him. He seems reluctant because he is so very guilt ridden and depressed. Since he is such a good friend and brother he says he feels comfortable with my counsel. He and his family came to me on many previous occasions, when I was an elder, for scriptural counsel. (too bad I only gave him WTS scriptural counsel)
    I don’t want his family to be destroyed and I want him to not be plagued by his sins so I too am seeking counsel from those not judging from an ‘organizational’ viewpoint.
    As I have already told him, Jehovah is the only one that needs to forgive him and he says that he feels like it will take some time but by “coming forward” to a judicial committee he would rather die then destroy his family. What else can I tell him?
    use 2 b a dub


  42. DanielB says:

    There are a number of us here who will help him with the problem in a confidential environment , and not so public , as his situation may warrant , because ” for waging war you need guidance , and for victory many advisors ” . [proverbs 24:6]

    I , for one , am open to discussing his problem . My email is dansgarden@tymewyse.com

    There is no Scriptural basis for a “Judicial Committee” to help him work through his guilt and his conscience on this matter . I know that he feels he needs to be open and reveal this to his wife . However , that is specific thinking of the WTS . He may , or may not , need to do this in the near future .

    I am glad that you console this brother . There are others here who are willing and able to assist him too .

    There is no reason that he and his family would be socially destroyed if we can help him .

    Your brother , Daniel


  43. steamrolled says:

    I feel that he should not mention it but leave it be-especially if it was in the past and is no longer practicing it-why needlessly destroy relationships over the past.


  44. Willie says:

    Dear Use 2 b a dub, I liked the advice that DanielB gave you. The fact that your fiend is repentant is the best ingredient in this sorrowful mix. The next consideration is whether or not he was consecrated/anointed. If he was not, then he is in the position of any sinner who repents of his sins–this sin being one of the worst, we feel, because it has the potential to hurt so many others. Though there are different requirements for the consecrated and the unconsecrated, I feel that only those who are consecrated and UNrepentant of their sins will be in danger of perishing eternally, and our eternal destiny is the greatest consideration of all.
    If this affair is truly over, if no pregancy is pending and no child was produced, and if the former girl-friend is not vindictive, and would tell of the affair just to see how she could hurt him, I know of no reason to confess to the wife, ailing or well, under the circumstances. If my husband had had an affair, especially if he had repented of it, I know that I wouldn’t want to know. The marriage might survive, but my feelings would never be the same toward him. Considering the repercussions of confessing in his situation as a fading JW, it seems to me that if he has confessed to you (Jam. 5:16), and if he has confessed to God Almighty (I John 1:9) then that should be sufficient in this particular case.
    Being truly repentant he would NEVER do this again under any circumstances. He sufferd from depression because he was guilty and he still has a conscience. Depression is part of the stripes (which can be mental as well as physical) he is receiving for the sin he committed (Luke 12:47,48). Since he has asked for forgiveness from God, those feelings of depression should improve with time. He should concentrate on loving righteousness and hating iniquity (Heb. 1:9) for our Lord Jesus is our pattern. Perhaps memorizing Psalm 51:10 would also be helpful: “Create in me a clean heart, O God; and renew a right spirit within me.”
    Sister Willie


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