Where was the Organization in the 18th century, the 17th century, the 16th century, the 12th century, the 6th century, etc?  There was none. Why should it be any different today?

If one lived in the ten-tribe kingdom there was never a time when things were right. True, Jehu got rid of Baal worship, but the idolatrous calf worship remained. And Hosea indicated that there would be an accounting against the house of Jehu for the bloodshed at Jezreel. Elijah was so discouraged that he thought he was alone in the ten-tribe kingdom. Unknown to him, there were the “7,000” who had not bent the knee to Baal. (1 Kings 19:18)  For all those people, there was no “Organization” or safe haven. Things were not that much better in the two-tribe kingdom. And when Jesus Christ carried on his activity, the Organization that then existed (The Synagogue, Pharisees, Sanhedrin, etc.) violently opposed him and wanted him dead. Jesus himself was disfellowshipped by their Organization. (See this previous post)

What really is an Organization? It is the individuals who run it. The individuals who have the voice of control. If anything can be learned from the Scriptures, it is that God never worked through an Organization but raised up prophets to call the Organization or the “nation” to repentance, and the Organization (the men with the power of control), for the most part, resisted the words of the prophets. The Organization, or nation (as represented by the men with the power) proved to be the great hindrance when it came to individuals responding to the Son of God. They were afraid. So the question that needs to be asked is, What do you understand the Organization to be? If the answer is the nation of Israel, the next question is,  What examples are there to show that being in harmony with the nation of Israel and its leadership was the only way to have God’s approval? What does Acts 10:34, 35, say about whom God accepts?


“For a certainty I perceive that God is not partial, 35 but in every nation the man that fears him and works righteousness is acceptable to him.”


Has that changed? And where was the Organization for all the centuries immediately pior to the year when the Watchtower was first published? Stripped of all the claims, the Organization is a legal corporation, a vanity religious press, with a volunteer distribution channel, and like a corporation it has certain requirements for those who are its volunteers (rules and regulations, which it maintains are based on the Bible). The “Service Meeting” is primarily a pep rally for the purpose of stirring up the friends to distribute the literature and get more people as recruits to serve as volunteers to replenish the large numbers of brothers and sisters that fall away. Why don’t we ask for voluntary donations anymore? In 1990 when we switched to the new voluntary donation arrangement, much emphasis was placed on explaining that we needed to give the householder an opportunity to make a donation. And if they didn’t, then the publisher themselves were supposed to put the money in the box for the book or magazines that they handed out.  99.9% of the donations come from the rank and file Witnesses themselves, not from the little old lady that takes magazines on your return visit route. This in turn fuels the Watchtower Organization to continue this never-ending cycle. A former member of the writing dept staff related this account to me:


Years ago, when I was involved in writing the KM as part of one of a number of two-man teams, I wanted to make it something that would give the meeting a Scriptural content, something that would be encouraging and helpful in our walk as disciples of God’s Son. Well, that  did not go over very “big.” At the meeting where the contents were discussed and the various teams from the Service Department were present (I was the only one from the department where I worked), Milton Henschel walked in, threw the manuscript copy on which I and another brother had worked on the table and said in a contemptuous tone, “I don’t know what the rest of you think. But this sounds like a miniature Watchtower!” Of course, no one said a peep. Yet how very strange it was. The magazine that is touted as providing the “food at the proper time” became a word of contempt. Obviously, Milton Henschel never realized the implication, but he revealed the real purpose…rally the troops to do the work. Teaching what the Bible says is not our concern.


We are commanded to meet together as Christians. We all need the encouragement of those that are “related to us in the faith” (Galatians 6:10)  and this will never change. Iron sharpens iron. But are we required to belong to the WT Organization to do this? The scriptures don’t seem to indicate this is a Christian requirement.

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13 Comments on Has God Always Had an Organization?

  1. rus virgil says:

    I have read the Bible .
    I have never found the word “organization” , nor the fact that God would ever had or has an organization on earth .
    The humans wants to understand through the word “organization” God’s theocratic arrangement. BUT what really would fit with this word (organization), it is only in Heavens !
    God’s Organization (theocratic arrangement) is in Heaven and it is Heavenly.
    And when Jesus Christ came on earth , he did not call that “God’s organization” but God’s KINGDOM !
    And he taught us that Father’s will is that this Kingdom to come on earth.
    And he taught us to pray for that.
    And because Father commanded to Jesus followers to “obey the Son” , they are praying until today “Let Your Kingdom come…”
    That is the most powerful proof that “God’s Organization” is not on earth today, because we all admit that this Kingdom is not here yet !

    Well, but then , what does God has on earth ?
    He says He has a people !
    But did he have always “a people” on earth ?
    NO ! because the history of His chosen people did begun with God’s “pulling his people out of Egypt”.
    So, before of that event God had individuals and family .
    When the Israelites entered in Egypt they were a “family” (of seventy souls)

    And what God always has on earth are “human souls” because He is the OWNER of them
    4. “Behold, all souls are Mine;
    the soul of the father as well as the soul of the son is Mine
    The soul who sins will die.
    Ezekiel 18.

    What is God doing “always” is that:
    2 The LORD looks down from heaven
    on all mankind
    to see if there are any who understand,
    any who seek God.
    Psalm 14.

    So, we can say that “always” God had on earth individuals who “seek after Him”, to know (understand) Him – but not organization!

    Now , Jesus formed the “Christian community” , something within God’s Kingdom has to come .
    And how does He did it ?
    The two greatest commandments (to love God…and the neighbor) seems to be not enough for that…
    As a planet is formed by firstly fixing its “center/point of gravity” so did Jesus:
    He gave “a new commandment” to His followers:
    34. “A new commandment I give to you, that you love one another, even as I have loved you, that you also love one another.
    35. “By this all men will know that you are My disciples, if you have love for one another.”
    John 13

    Through these words Jesus has fixed the “center of gravity” for the Christian community !
    There was never need for a human organization to keep His faithful ones united !
    That commandment works (like a gravitational force) in those who really have faith in Jesus and it produces unity (not uniformity).
    Within this community (worldwide) the Heavenly Kingdom of God will “come on earth” in short time/at God’s established time.

    I hope it is understandable.

    with love,
    in Christ
    rus v.


    • rus virgil says:

      Regarding much used phrase: “God doesn’t deal with individuals, only with his organization” there is an inspired scripture proving how God deals with men:
      Job 34
      29. When He keeps quiet, who then can condemn?
      And when He hides His face, who then can behold Him,
      That is, in regard to both nation and man?–

      So, Jehovah deals with “both nation and man”/ individuals and group of individuals/people/nation (his people).


    • JJ says:

      Thank you Rus- outstanding piece of reasoning. Thank you brother I am going to try and use that with my family.


      • rus virgil says:

        After pondering for several years over the prophecies ,
        and after reading the works(studies – in romanian) of an anointed brother, I have strive to put them in a logical order and form with the purpose to be easier understood for readers (because the Spirit is higher than man’s way of thinking/reasoning , the writings of the anointed one are rather hard to understand by simple man)…
        …I came to conclude as it follows (in my words):
        — that God’s word (found in the O.T. ) forms a “background” for the “teaching of Christ”
        — the “teaching of Christ” is truth (John 1:17) and it is (or it forms) the “basis” for the true interpretation/understanding of the prophecies (that means that the true interpretation of the prophecies depends entirely on the “teaching of Christ”, which is “the base” for further interpretations of prophecies )
        — the “Song of Moses” (found in Deut. 32:1-43) is the “spinal column”(mine expression) of the prophecies concerning God’s people during the “latter days” and the “end time” / it is impossible to understand the order in time , or the chronological order of the fulfillment of prophetical actions during the latter days , if not studied the Song of Moses; it gives the reasons why Jehovah has acted so or so toward/or with His people during the “latter days”
        it is no wonder that the firstly ones who sing this Song and really appreciate it are “those who follows the Lamb” and “who had come off victorious from the beast and from his statue”
        from these ones also others may learn this Song .

        Now here , in this thread http://www.paradisecafediscuss.....p?tid=1116 I have tried to put/express in english some reasons from prophecies .

        As I learned english by myself and being a low-minded person , I know/I am conscient that I couldn’t express it correctly , but still,
        I hope you (JJ and others) will find more reasons to think of or to ponder over , regarding – when Christ started to reign in Heavens-, what means his “second coming” , and the way God is seeing his own people during the “later days”
        anyway, my posts there are incomplete , there is much more to say and to fit with other prophecies , things I am not able to speak.
        I meant for my thread to be only an “input” for further studies.

        Let Jehovah bless you all “seekers for His Kingdom and righteousness”

        rus virgil


  2. Jayme says:

    Great comments JJ!

    I especially liked the reasoning in the last paragraph.

    Conversely, may I ask… “does choosing to remain and meet together with the WT org. fulfill our obligtion to meet together as “christians”?” I ask because many do not feel that the Org nor its loyal adherants fit the scriptural criteria of one “related to us in the faith”.


    • JJ says:

      Interesting questions Jayme. Are JWs Christians? Is that the crux of your question? If it is, I would have to say yes. “Doctrinal correctness” is a topic we’ve discussed on this site before and it seems that if we throw out some numbers (even at random) it helps to make the point:



      Out of a hundred people you would get 100 different percentages on these groups right? So if there are “righteous” people following any of these Christian religions, what is our Judge, Jesus Christ going to do? Save them, or kill them at Armageddon? That’s for each of us to figure out. But if we respect and pray to God our Father and “bend our knee” to his Son as the perfect savior and judge, who’s to say…


      • Jayme says:

        Thanks JJ,

        Yes, I see what you mean. I think that most of these doctinal differances are not “salvation issues” and will easily be remedied at Christs return. What my conscience is troubled most about is the issue of how our salvation is accomplished. The majority of the denominations teach, what I feel, is the basic scriptural teaching on this. The WT teaches something differant in that they twist the way that the New Covenant works. For instance,sadly the majority of the New Testament is taught to not be for some 99.99% of the brotherhood. There is alot that I admire about the Org. and I feel that they are bible based but I wonder if they are Christ based. Is there a differance?

        Just some of my concerns. I know we have gone over some of this before and I dont want to hog up this post with it all but it is on my mind because I am still trying to decide whether I can go back or not. I need to do something, one way or the other. As a JW I learned alot of good biblical principles and a desire for God, things that I would like my kids to learn. But because of their unique New Covenant theology I dont know if I really ever obtained the knowledge needed to enter into a saving relationship with Christ, and that I feel is a salvation issue.


      • greybeard says:

        Hi JJ, and all on here… I’m trying to come out of hiding… casting my ego aside… lol

        Anyway, JJ your comment caught my interest. You said, “So if there are “righteous” people following any of these Christian religions, what is our Judge, Jesus Christ going to do? Save them, or kill them at Armageddon? That’s for each of us to figure out.”

        Honestly, I don’t think any of us can figure this one out but my guess is that Jesus will save every human being regardless of religion / race or creed if he can. If he sees potential in their hearts. Is there not going to be a resurrection of the righteous and unrighteous?

        As far as your percentage of truth regarding Christian religions I believe you were quite generous. My guess would be more like nobody has much truth at all. Why do I feel that way?

        Well basically we have two groups of Christians on this planet. We have your ONE CHANCE HELL FIRE Christians and we have your ONE to TWO CHANCE ETERNAL DESTRUCTION Christians.

        I don’t agree with either of those groups. WHY? Jesus taught us limitless forgiveness. Not 7 times but 77 representing endless. He was the image of the invisible God. So God must be the same, endless forgiveness for his children.

        Many on this planet, and I know a few myself, are just figuring out right and wrong in there old age. They still have a way to go before finding God. God isn’t going to give each person enough time to grow?

        What do we as humans really know for sure anyway?
        We only know what true love is because it is written in our hearts.
        We know how a father and mother should love their children. Is God any different?
        We don’t know all the facts about the Bible.
        We don’t know all the facts about Jesus.
        We don’t know all the facts about God.
        What we do know is God is LOVE and we do know what LOVE is.

        When the Bible says that Christ died for ALL men, I believe the word ALL means ALL.

        Most religions want to scare the human into believing their way and JW’s are at the top of that list. I have not found any religion I can agree with on this planet so I let my heart guide me and I am open minded to all possibilities as long as LOVE is the central theme. When this is all over and we are in Gods Kingdom, I believe we will be amazed at how forgiving God really is.

        Your brother,


        • Dennis says:

          Hi GB,

          You said, “When this is all over and we are in Gods Kingdom, I believe we will be amazed at how forgiving God really is.”

          This is something that I have mentioned to my dad and mom a few times. I believe that it is man who places limits on Gods love and usually for the purpose of furthering their own agendas.



  3. andrew says:

    Also during the patriarchal time, God dealt with individuals not with any organization.
    When Israel arrived in the promised land for quite some time each did according to what was good in his eyes, or in other words there was no organization.

    God has a household but it is not an organization, it is those Christians who truly follow his Son without regard to what church they belong.


  4. andrew says:

    Nice to hear from you Greybeard



  5. Amos says:

    Greetings Greybeard,

    I generaly agree with your entire post, & would like to add the following comments.

    Regarding those who survive Armageddon; I see two options that MAY be what will happen…
    1. The only survivors will be the Anointed Saints.
    2. The Anointed & the majority of mankind, excluding those who get in the way of the destruction as satan’s system gets destroyed.

    The actual point that strikes me is that the scriptures don’t really give any clear statements concerning this. The best man can do is to read some interpretation into a few verses, & then say that this is what YHWH is going to do….when in fact we are just guessing, this is called “eisergesis”.

    Your brother,


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